@BigD

Less than £100 for the 2GB version is what we are aiming for. 4GB version should be slightly higher.

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Amiga Kit Amiga Store
Links: www.amigakit.com | New Products | A600GS

@amigakit

Well that puts you in the running cost wise if you hit that price. However, you are banking on RGL's apathy and the likes of me and the legions of users/developers already behind THEA500 Mini giving up on it to buy a more expensive product with a less nostalgic case for more online functionality and a few polished up A-EON applications. The main problem I have with your approach is you're attempting to fragment another Amiga niche micro-market like AmigaOS and MorphOS and WarpUp and PowerUp before it!

Here we go again!

Last edited by BigD on 15-Aug-2023 at 09:04 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@amigakit

Sounds interesting. being able to turn the machine on and not have to soft mod the thing to play around in Amiga os would be a good feature.

Also, I don't know how feasible it would be but, perhaps having a hub for all these indie amiga developers to put their games on, and if some of them wanted to charge for their games it could be beneficial for everybody.

Anyway I'm looking forward to what you have in store.

@amigakit

Is the little black box the final design for the case or do you have plans for something more unique and memorable.

Will the mouse and game pad be unique to the A600GS or will it be the mouse you already sell and the a SNES style joypad. While I'm sure they are both competent it will make the system seem less professional and there'll be little incentive to buy them as separate items. If you could resurrect the Competition Pro/Honeybee pad that would really stand out and would appeal beyond the Amiga scene since the same design was used for the SNES and the Megadrive had it's own variation.

I understand that getting moulds made adds to costs but presentation is really important if you want to sell it to a wider audience. Software features and functionality won't matter if it does not have a premium look and feel.

Since customers can optionally sign up for an Amisphere account, do you intend to have an online store for the A600GS? I think this is something where Retro Games missed a trick with The A500 mini. There will be a certain percentage of customers who probably wouldn't have the slightest idea about how to add their own software who would happily buy additional games if the option was there. An online store also gives an additional outlet to developers of new games gaining them wider exposure they might not have otherwise got.

How do you plan to market and sell the A600GS?

@Rob

Thanks for the feedback.

The case is still in development.

AMIStore will feature in a forthcoming system update, but not on immediate release. The core system functionality is being finalised. Subsequent system updates will bring incremental features. We aim to support community developers through this.

_________________
Amiga Kit Amiga Store
Links: www.amigakit.com | New Products | A600GS

@amigakit

Quote:

AMIStore will feature in a forthcoming system update, but not on immediate release.

Since that is your USP, that DOES need to be ready for launch on Day 1 I would advise. However, it's your business and I'm resigned to the fact you are taking on the best selling Amiga computer in a generation with an A-EON style soft launch! How did that go for the A1222+? That's right, a re-design required before a second hobbled post-covid, supply chain limited launch! I don't think you've thought this out beyond....

..."When it's done!"

It's just my opinion though and I sure a limited number of "in the know" Amigans will buy it! However, you cannot expect to sell them in the 100,000s range of magnitude without the marketing and distribution reach of a company like Koch Media/Plaion as a partner. Have you got an Amiga Corporation licence for any branding or will it have the Amiga.org logo on it?

Last edited by BigD on 15-Aug-2023 at 10:20 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 15-Aug-2023 at 10:17 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 15-Aug-2023 at 10:16 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@agami

I doubt you’ll see a “product” bundle as you describe using Emu68 anytime soon, as Emu68 is specifically targeting Raspberry Pi hardware, and nothing else. So the only company that would be able to make the “bundle” you appear to want would be Raspberry Pi themselves.

Oh, and I don’t get it - If you don’t like DIY, why on earth are you wasting time with Amiga? Amiga - the computer for the creative mind - remember? It was always a lot of DIY with Amiga.

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B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@kolla

Most A500 users I know from school thought a hard drive was a PC thing and thought floppies were an Amiga thing! Plenty didn't void their warranty sticker!

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

In terms of styling and design, the A600GS uses our own branding. It will also utilise our system software.

The core system development is large body of work. It will be necessary to release AMIStore and enhancements in the following months as Live Updates from the Amisphere server. This will be a straight foward download and install process.

_________________
Amiga Kit Amiga Store
Links: www.amigakit.com | New Products | A600GS

@BigD

I’m tempted to say that this just means you grew up in UK, where any computer system first and foremost are for games. But let’s ignore that. Those users you describe, would you call them Amiga enthusiasts, or games enthusiasts who just happened to have an Amiga for gaming the little period it was relevant? What difference would they make for us more seasoned Amiga enthusiasts today? What has the THEA500 user base brought us? All genuine development is on the Linux side, and all 68k related work is about bringing existing “DIY” projects (various games collections) also to the THEA500 - most of that activity too orchestrated from Linux and Windows.

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B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@amigakit

So you are building your own proprietary operating system and your own proprietary emulator? Will the systems be open, with something akin to the Amiga hardware reference manual available? Or do you plan for a closed garded garden model, where you will try to squash anyone who don’t intend to use the device with your services?

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B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@kolla

Quote:

What difference would they make for us more seasoned Amiga enthusiasts today? What has the THEA500 user base brought us?

I honestly don't care what the new users will bring for you as we are not running a pyramid scheme here!

They're people first and foremost that either remember Amiga productivity software or games or fall in love with it for the first time! Kids allowed to mess around with Project-X, Worms, The Settlers, PacMan500, TinyBobble etc and to learn to animate using Deluxe Paint or to program on Scorpion Engine or Blitz Basic 2, that is what we can offer to THEM! It's fun, engaging and appeals to them at a core level before social media saps all that creative energy!

THEA500 Mini userbase is one of the only ways our community can and is growing! We can teach them how to do more with it, just as we tried to get A500 users to upgrade to an A1200 or to see the value of putting a Hard Drive in their 'miggy! Yes, they probably will go back to playing Qwak or Alien Breed (both great games) but we can try and a few might start modding to get CD32 games running or experimenting with emulators and maybe even coding or animating or possibly Lightwave modelling! This is all possible with this 'toy' as a starting point just like the original A500!

Last edited by BigD on 15-Aug-2023 at 11:36 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@amigakit

If it ends up being as you say, then there is some promise in your goal, and I sincerely wish it comes to fruition. To which I make myself available with free advice at your discretion.

THEA500 Mini is a nice retro gaming console that has proven to be more with a little DIY effort, but as you say, the RGL goals are completed.

“Don’t give me songs. Give me something to sing about”. This is where my hopes lie for your initiative.

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All the way, with 68k

@kolla

Quote:

kolla wrote: @agami I doubt you’ll see a “product” bundle as you describe using Emu68 anytime soon, as Emu68 is specifically targeting Raspberry Pi hardware, and nothing else. So the only company that would be able to make the “bundle” you appear to want would be Raspberry Pi themselves.

What?!?! Any other company can buy a bunch of Raspberry Pi SBCs and stick them inside a custom enclosure and bundle it with AROS 68k + emu68.

Quote:

Oh, and I don’t get it - If you don’t like DIY, why on earth are you wasting time with Amiga? Amiga - the computer for the creative mind - remember? It was always a lot of DIY with Amiga.

Is this you being deliberately obtuse?
You know very well that out of the box a Commodore Amiga was a usable product. One didn’t need to buy hardware from C=, then get a case from one place, the OS from somewhere else, then get some special libraries form a third place, just to get things up and running.

Unlike a project, a product should be usable out of the box, and can have DIY as part of its extensible architecture. By design and/or by omission. Which was the case with C= Amiga computers and THEA500 Mini.

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All the way, with 68k

amigakit wrote:
Quote:

Less than £100 for the 2GB version is what we are aiming for. 4GB version should be slightly higher.

Nice! Far cheaper than an assembled MiST at 214 pounds UK or an assembled Ultimate MiSTer Pro at 499 Euros.

Truly,
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group - http://www.dickestel.com/fcug.htm
Southern California Commodore & Amiga Network - http://www.portcommodore.com/sccan

@agami

Quote:

agami wrote: @kolla Quote: kolla wrote: @agami I doubt you’ll see a “product” bundle as you describe using Emu68 anytime soon, as Emu68 is specifically targeting Raspberry Pi hardware, and nothing else. So the only company that would be able to make the “bundle” you appear to want would be Raspberry Pi themselves. What?!?! Any other company can buy a bunch of Raspberry Pi SBCs and stick them inside a custom enclosure and bundle it with AROS 68k + emu68.

Isn’t that what I suggested that AmigaKit could do, but that you didn’t want?

They don’t even have to make a custom enclosure, just replace the raspi logo on the keyboard of the rpi400 with theit oh so very much trademarked ticker.

Quote:

Quote: Oh, and I don’t get it - If you don’t like DIY, why on earth are you wasting time with Amiga? Amiga - the computer for the creative mind - remember? It was always a lot of DIY with Amiga. Is this you being deliberately obtuse? You know very well that out of the box a Commodore Amiga was a usable product.

Were they really?

As a simple games console perhaps, and big boxes to a degree, but really?

Quote:

One didn’t need to buy hardware from C=, then get a case from one place, the OS from somewhere else, then get some special libraries form a third place, just to get things up and running.

Oh? Let me see.. my A1200 from CBM, CPU card from Phase5, RAM from local vendor, disk from local vendor, ethernet card from IAM, OS from … Village Tronic(?) (since CBM didn’t bother to ship full OS disk set with the 3.0 A1200, lacking hdtoolbox etc).. third party drivers and libs all over the place (which still is the case today).

(Where were the Commodore CPU/ram boards for A1200?!)

A4000 and A3000 alot of the same, sourcing ram from wherever, replacing A3640 with something with onboard ram, soldering the 2int line on A3000 to get I/O on cpu slot, hack and patch the OS with third party CPU libs, not to mention several competing RTG solutions, IP stacks etc.

What CBM provided was a bare minimum, on which we could and would expand upon with DIY and third party products, much of which also was “garage” quality.

Quote:

Unlike a project, a product should be usable out of the box, and can have DIY as part of its extensible architecture. By design and/or by omission. Which was the case with C= Amiga computers and THEA500 Mini.

The THEA500 Mini is much more of a “out of the box” product” any real Amiga ever was. It also targets a different audience - consumers.

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B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@RobertB

Quote:

RobertB wrote: amigakit wrote: Quote: Less than £100 for the 2GB version is what we are aiming for. 4GB version should be slightly higher. Nice! Far cheaper than an assembled MiST at 214 pounds UK or an assembled Ultimate MiSTer Pro at 499 Euros.

Also a totally different product, this A600GC isn’t FPGA, it’s an ARM system with software emulation - like the THEA500. Like any Raspberry pi with amiberry on it.

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B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@kolla

Quote:

what CBM provided was a bare minimum, on which we could and would expand upon with DIY and third party products, much of which also was “garage” quality.

I disagree, many people stuck with stock machines and played games from floppy. The software houses acted accordingly assuming a stock configuration for 90% of games with the A500's 0.5MB Chip Ram expansion (giving 1MB chip ram total) the ONLY widely accepted exception! Developers couldn't even assume HD floppy support as standard for AGA software/games because of cost cutting on the A1200 to not use custom 150rpm drives and no revision of Paula...ever!

Last edited by BigD on 16-Aug-2023 at 10:20 AM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Keyword being “games” - do these people qualify as “Amiga users”?

Would you call Chromebook, Android and Steam deck owners “Linux users”?

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B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@kolla

Yes, they qualify. I ran PageStream 2.2 from floppy too with a 'stock' configuration until I bought a hard drive. It WAS possible to run a home office with a stock A1200.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios