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number6 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 4-Sep-2007 15:36:06
#21 ]
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Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11540
From: In the village

@Turrican3

Forgive me. Maybe I misunderstand you.
But how does this apply to either the reality stated by Jens or the statement by Fleecy, which are the only 2 examples I cited?

#6


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Turrican3 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 4-Sep-2007 15:29:56
#22 ]
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Joined: 20-Jun-2003
Posts: 386
From: Italy

http://www.amigahistory.co.uk/jan3rd2000.html

Quote:
Here is what was acquired from Gateway:

1. All trademarks logo's etc.
2. All existing inventory of Amiga International
3. All existing licenses.
4. License to All Amiga patents (Gateway still owns the patents, but we are able to use them).
5. All web sites, and registered domain names.
6. The Amiga OS and all that is associated with the OS.
7. The Amiga operation as it exists today.


Assuming everything's true (after all it was an executive update courtesy by Bill McEven ) this sounds like a confirmation of what I've stated before: OS4 should not be affected by this change of ownership.

But you know, never say never with the Amiga.

Last edited by Turrican3 on 04-Sep-2007 at 04:42 PM.

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number6 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 4-Sep-2007 14:58:12
#23 ]
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Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11540
From: In the village

@all

Maybe this would be easier with a "real world" example.
When this long thread started in October, 2006:
Quote:
Individual Computers Announces Clone-A Project

http://www.amiga.org/modules/news/article.php?storyid=7004
I searched the page for "kickstart". No hits.

Then, this thread appeared on March 9, 2007:
Quote:
 Individual Computers at CeBit, Clone-A presentation on march 31st

http://amigaworld.net/modules/news/article.php?storyid=3641

Gleng to Jens Schoenfeld:
Quote:
Can I ask a potentially stupid question?
Does the user need to provide a kickstart ROM image to use the Clone A, or does it include one? (Or does it not need one?)
If it includes one, doesn't it need to be licensed from AInc?


Jens Schoenfeld to Gleng:
Quote:
The kickstart needs licensing, of course. AInc is already informed, and they are very cooperative.


Flash forward to this thread on April 23, 2007:
Quote:
New Hardware Designs from ACK Software Controls, Inc. and Amiga, Inc.

http://amigaworld.net/modules/news/article.php?storyid=3721&start=120

Jens Schoenfeld:
Quote:
Bill McEwen, who hasn't been able to give any proof of ownership of the classic Amiga OS in the past 20 months, who wanted to send me contracts "by the end of the week" (that was in february),


Kickstart?

Then we have Fleecy from a q/a here on AW:
http://amigaworld.net/modules/fleecymoss/index.php?cat_id=20#191

Quote:
10) Asemoon: Will the classic Amiga ROMs ( v1.0-3.1) be included on the AmigaOS4 CD for UAE emulation?

Fleecy: We are looking into this but no decision has been made. It is likely that we will work with Cloanto since they are the only ones with an established and legal product in this area.


Can Amiga Inc. directly license the kickstart to Jens, since he stated this as a need?
If not...why not?
Are Jens issues above and what fleecy stated related or non-related in nature?

#6

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estik 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 4-Sep-2007 13:33:16
#24 ]
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Joined: 13-Oct-2004
Posts: 587
From: Pacos de Ferreira, Portugal

@Turrican3

Quote:


So I wonder: assuming I'm right and Acer/Gateway revokes the license, how this would affect OS4?

Not so much, I'm afraid.


That's it.

Not much.
People are starting to dream on allready.
Lets's stop it for once, ok?

Acer is the leading brand concerning laptops here in Portugal and Spain.
I doubt it if they do know what Amiga is, other than perhaps a mobile games software company

Last edited by estik on 04-Sep-2007 at 01:35 PM.

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Turrican3 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 4-Sep-2007 11:07:12
#25 ]
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Joined: 20-Jun-2003
Posts: 386
From: Italy

I'm not sure this is actually relevant for what is Amiga today.

I mean, IIRC Amino (or AInc. if you want) got the licence for the patents... but bought (fully owns, but maybe now it's more correct to say owned) the entire operating system.

So I wonder: assuming I'm right and Acer/Gateway revokes the license, how this would affect OS4?

Not so much, I'm afraid.

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Sneaky 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 4-Sep-2007 9:11:02
#26 ]
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Joined: 24-Apr-2007
Posts: 134
From: Franconia/Bavaria/Germany

@number6

Quote:
Listening to the .ogg again today. Carl said:
Quote:
Quote:It was published

etc.


Aeh, sorry I don't get what you try to say here And I don't have the time to listen to the whole thing again.
My point was, if your diggin for Prior Art in order to cancel a granted Patent, you are searching for implementations and proof of implementations, not for prior granted Patents. And I'm pretty sure to remember Carl Sassenrath said it in a similar context.

Quote:
Later he referred to the hardware museum in a separate section, but he clearly refers to something written here. The hardware museum he said was part of a patent firm, not his own.


If I remember correctly the Patent-firms do mostly have such Museums for general Hardware. I was reffering to his personal Amiga and Commodore cellar stuff he somtimes pulls out. IMHO he doesn't call it a museum in that session.
So that got a little bit messed up, because I didn't remember that there was another part where he refers to the term "museum" Sorry for that.

Edit: spelling

Last edited by Sneaky on 04-Sep-2007 at 09:27 AM.

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olegil 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 4-Sep-2007 6:37:56
#27 ]
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Joined: 22-Aug-2003
Posts: 5895
From: Work

@AmigaMac

Whenever someone with a PPC core puts it in an AMD-style chip, with the same peripheral controllers as AMD use on their chips.

Sorry, that wasn't very specific, was it? But at this point, it's just a matter of deciding to do it. They all have the technology (IBM, Freescale, AMCC, PA Semi), that is on-chip DDR2 controllers, hypertransport, pcie etc...

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AmigaMac 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 4-Sep-2007 0:33:12
#28 ]
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Joined: 26-Oct-2002
Posts: 1094
From: 3rd Rock from the Sun!

@Samurai_Crow

Furthermore, as PowerPC chips adopt the AMD-style chip sockets, it will be much easier for interested third parties to make Amiga-compatible hardware.

When the heck is that going to happen???

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spudmiga 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 4-Sep-2007 0:28:12
#29 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 12-Dec-2002
Posts: 855
From: England, United Kingdom

@Samurai_Crow

Quote:

Samurai_Crow wrote:
@Fransexy

What you say is possible. But not all of the Amiga patents are still in effect and there is a legal limit to how long they can be renewed (I think.) Gateway may have had it coming though, and Acer knows how to get things done. Furthermore, as PowerPC chips adopt the AMD-style chip sockets, it will be much easier for interested third parties to make Amiga-compatible hardware. I predict that the Acer problem will be smaller than the Amiga, Inc. problem.


Of course it will, acer know actually know what they are doing.

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number6 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 3-Sep-2007 21:15:14
#30 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11540
From: In the village

@Sneaky

Quote:
But if I remember correctly, he is mostly contacted to "smash" a patent of someone else with the proof of "prior art" done by Amiga/Commodore and he does it with his private little HW-Museum. So the Patents originally held by Commodore are not involved, which doesn't proof or disproove their current status.


Listening to the .ogg again today.
Carl said:
Quote:
It was published
etc.
Later he referred to the hardware museum in a separate section, but he clearly refers to something written here. The hardware museum he said was part of a patent firm, not his own.

Also interesting was his reference to:
Quote:
all of us that were engineers at amiga get those calls constantly from lawyers


#6

Last edited by number6 on 03-Sep-2007 at 09:28 PM.
Last edited by number6 on 03-Sep-2007 at 09:21 PM.

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Sneaky 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 3-Sep-2007 21:09:20
#31 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 24-Apr-2007
Posts: 134
From: Franconia/Bavaria/Germany

@number6

But if I remember correctly, he is mostly contacted to "smash" a patent of someone else with the proof of "prior art" done by Amiga/Commodore and he does it with his private little HW-Museum. So the Patents originally held by Commodore are not involved, which doesn't proof or disproove their current status.

Last edited by Sneaky on 03-Sep-2007 at 09:10 PM.

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number6 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 3-Sep-2007 18:34:56
#32 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11540
From: In the village

@all

An extremely interesting read (listen) in the Carl Sassenrath banquet speech from Amiwest 2006 (1:11 into the .ogg file).
He was asked whether he still had Amigas.
He answered basically what he used them for at that time.
He said the main motivator for turning them on is "lawyers", who contact him regarding what is known as "prior art in patent cases"
An example he noted was current 1/2 billion dollar lawsuit over patents involving Amiga technology. In that case, it was CDTV patent from 1993, proving an existing technology.
So..if you hear people saying the old patents have expired or are meaningless,
you might think about that.

#6

Last edited by number6 on 03-Sep-2007 at 07:50 PM.

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Rob 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 3-Sep-2007 18:27:22
#33 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Mar-2003
Posts: 6344
From: S.Wales

@Pleng

Amiga could have been doing that years ago, but they're a bit slow on the uptake.

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Pleng 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 3-Sep-2007 18:18:00
#34 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 17-Nov-2005
Posts: 458
From: Unknown

@amigakid

Well I suppose you could see UAE springing up pre-installed on Acer computers along with a load of retro abandonware games. A cute little selling point for Acer laptops, that would be!

Or maybe they could manufacture Amiga joystics that plug directly into the TV and have retro games stored on them. Like the Sega Megadrive pads you see going for £20. Hell Amiga could be doing that right now...

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number6 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 3-Sep-2007 17:04:10
#35 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11540
From: In the village

@Fransexy

Quote:
Could this have any relevance or impact to Amiga?

To Amiga Inc. and therefore to "amigans", yes.

Quote:
If i remember well Gateway still owns Amiga patents, they only gave permission to Amiga inc to use them.

Yes. Unlimited use, but not for long, eh?

http://www.google.com/patents?q=amiga
I believe you can get some shorter lists by entering "amiga" and then 2nd name like "gateway" or "acer".

Time regarding expirations? It was mentioned on another website, for example, the OCS expired 2004/5 but AGA not until 2012. Still looking into this.

Very interesting topic Fransexy....very interesting.

#6

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amigakid 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 29-Aug-2007 6:31:58
#36 ]
Member
Joined: 19-Nov-2003
Posts: 49
From: Washington State - USA

Amiga patents?? heh they prob will find them and laugh, or go down memory lane to the days of 2d platformers. Dont expect them to get all excited and roll out new Amiga's though, i'm sure they wouldn't spend the money on it.

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Leo 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 28-Aug-2007 21:58:52
#37 ]
Super Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 1597
From: Unknown

Quote:

Maybe ACER can aquire Amigainc while they are at it

What for ?

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Rudei 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 28-Aug-2007 20:53:27
#38 ]
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Joined: 20-Nov-2002
Posts: 3589
From: Dallas, Texas

@Fransexy

Lets hope they call in the patents and do something with them.
Oh here's to wishing!

Rude!


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NomadOfNorad 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 28-Aug-2007 3:17:41
#39 ]
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Joined: 2-Jun-2003
Posts: 746
From: Jacksonville, Florida, USA, Earth, Sol system, Milky Way galaxy

@Darth_X

I said the same thing when I first heard about the buyout of Gateway. Hehe!

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Darth_X 
Re: Acer To Acquire Gateway
Posted on 27-Aug-2007 22:19:05
#40 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 1-Jun-2003
Posts: 2997
From: Vancouver Island, Canada

@Samurai_Crow

Quote:

Samurai_Crow wrote:
@Fransexy

What you say is possible. But not all of the Amiga patents are still in effect and there is a legal limit to how long they can be renewed (I think.) Gateway may have had it coming though, and Acer knows how to get things done. Furthermore, as PowerPC chips adopt the AMD-style chip sockets, it will be much easier for interested third parties to make Amiga-compatible hardware. I predict that the Acer problem will be smaller than the Amiga, Inc. problem.


Maybe ACER can aquire Amigainc while they are at it

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