@WolfToTheMoon

Calling AmigaOS a pig (with a lipstick) as a metaphor?
Humans so often lower themselves quickly.

Yes, there are many limitations in old OS 3.x And many were removed by development of OS4. So they were wrong. They just wanted the quick solution.

Renaming OS is not a vision.

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Probably the only reason why Hyperion still develops OS4 is that it's the only thing they've got going. MOS was supposed to break out of Amiga API with qBox, that was the plan. They never even considered modernizing the original OS.

Seems they still plan it, maybe about MOS 4. Tan and see.

Emulation is nice when you have to break full compatibility, like today emulation boxes (virtual machines) are. But that is the last step. OS4 will come to that surely also one day, but by natural progression.

Quote:

Probably the only reason why Hyperion still develops OS4 is that it's the only thing they've got going. MOS was supposed to break out of Amiga API with qBox, that was the plan. They never even considered modernizing the original OS.

And because people want it. Few folk yet, but without it, it would have no point.

Same could be said for Amiga Inc and its second level sellers: CUSA and iCoin:
Probably the only reason why they try to mimic Amigas is because its the only
thing they`ve got going.

So we are now. But InI sometimes get worried why you are here at all since everything from 90s is obsolete even AROS, MOS and OS4 did a lot of progress in last 3 years alone.

So InI are overoptimistic, you try to play "realistic" but to put down fellow humans efforts ... and cheer for rebrenders! Bravo, that is the way to flow in 2012!

Last edited by vox on 02-Dec-2011 at 08:27 PM.

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Future Acube and MOS supporter, fi di good, nothing fi di unprofessionals. Learn it harder way!

@Leo

Quote:

Quote: Petro confirmed the old rumor that Bill Gates didn't want a new Amiga system to compete with his PCs and so put pressure on the Gateway CEO. Serously: who would believe that ? At that time the Amiga was already long dead...

If I correctly remember, this was also mentioned in Amiga Future Magazines Amiga Retrospective articles by RT Dickinson.

What interestes me is what was RT Dickinsons source for this comment, or just rumors?

For if I correctly understood, this podcast mentioned have been done only very recently, while that retrospective article was maybe already 2 years ago or something.

Bill Gates is Devil, thats for sure :)...he kills everything thats good!
Now I must use Bill Gates Fuccin Xbox360 to play upcomming Halo4 and Skyrim!

Xbox 360 is surly a good machine for games but Gates make me sick

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AmigaOne X5000, AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition Update 2 special super 2 cores prepared super edition v75 christmas speciale uniqe quadro prepared AmigaOS... TWO MORE YEARS IS NOTHING IF YOU BEEN WAITING SINCE 1994..

@Leo

Quote:

Quote: Petro confirmed the old rumor that Bill Gates didn't want a new Amiga system to compete with his PCs and so put pressure on the Gateway CEO. Serously: who would believe that ? At that time the Amiga was already long dead...

Exactly.

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Amiga Developer
Amiga 500, Efika, Mac Mini and PowerBook

@clusteruk

Quote:

mostly from a show in Stockholm

I remember you there!

Well for those who haven't heard the recent news regarding this Secure Boot system for PCs should google it. For those who have read it - you quickly come to the conclusion that M$ is up to its old tricks yet again - this time all x86 alternative operating systems are a potential threat to their monopoly.

The sooner a government has the will and clout to force M$ to break up the better - they aren't doing anyone any favours. M$ will not rest until they gained 100% of the market -which is just not possible. They are so many people that despise Windows - but 'learn' to live with its shortcomings - poor operating system - so good damn slow - poor security - poor html support in outlook - internet explorer is just a joke very poor-compliance to open source standards.

When M$ bailed out Apple that was merely a gesture - they had already succeed in killing most of the competition by that point. WIthout Apple, M$ would certainly not be in the position that is now - world domination.

I put M$ in the same category as the oil cartels - a mafia type organisation that governments fear.

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Gates kills baby Seals too but only if they are a month old or less.

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Sent from my Quantum Computer.

I am convinced that Bill Gates pressed to kill Amiga, AMIGA in the era of Gateway was almost dead, but not quite, Amiga was a well known brand and there was a chance to return to stand and to compete with PC / Microsoft, A giant company like Microsoft does not leave anything to chance, It ensures 100x100 Amiga died.

Remember Blue Ribbon purchased by MS to kill Bars and Pipers.

Last edited by natamix on 03-Dec-2011 at 01:56 AM.
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@natamix

MS wants Blue Ribbon's employees for MS DirectMusic middleware.

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Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB
Amiga 1200 (Rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32lite/RPi 4B 4GB/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (Rev 6A, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 3a/Emu68)

I am not a fan of conspiracy theories, but I would love to hear this claim confirmed by Jim Collas, or any other former high ranking Gateway employee.

I don't think it is out of the realm of possibility that Gates, or someone else at MS threatened Gateway with unfavorable prices for Windows OEM licenses to remove any threat of Amiga making any kind of comeback. I think that Gateway was the Amiga's last and best chance of ever returning to the mainstream and I believe that it could have made a difference if the QNX partnership had happened. (Of course many die hard Amiga users would have left and stayed with their original Amiga systems because the QNX Amigas would have been too different)

It is well documented that Gates and Microsoft have killed off many other companies and innovations to protect their dominance, so why is it unbelievable that they would not keep their eye on what was happening with the Amiga, when they knew that it was the most advanced threat to their OS ever created up to that point in time. I am not saying that I believe this story without confirmation, but it is entirely possible that it is true.

Does anyone know what happened to Jim Collas and where he is right now?

Not that it will ever happen, but wouldn't it be great if this and other similar allegations could be proved against Microsoft and a class action suit could be won against them on behalf of all Amiga users worldwide? A few million dollars from Microsoft in payment to Amiga users and former Amiga users could make a nice dent in reviving activity in the Amiga community, though I am afraid that most people would just use their portion of the settlement money to buy more Windows, or Mac hardware, or just take their spouses out to dinner, or on a cruise.

Still, it is a nice thought to think about Microsoft being held accountable and paying a few million dollars to Amiga users for their evil deeds. I was sorely disappointed that Microsoft was not torn apart years ago when the monopoly litigation was instigated. Who knows how many computer innovations were killed off by Microsoft's stifling business practices?

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Amiga! The computer that inspired so many, to accomplish so much, but has ended up in the hands of . . . . . . . . . .

@Dandy

You mean the Amiga Persecution Complex is for real.

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Games, programs, reviews

It would be nice to have the Viva Amiga team interviewing Petro and Jim...

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www.loriano.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk

@Bugala

Quote:

Bugala wrote: @Leo Quote: Quote: Petro confirmed the old rumor that Bill Gates didn't want a new Amiga system to compete with his PCs and so put pressure on the Gateway CEO. Serously: who would believe that ? At that time the Amiga was already long dead... If I correctly remember, this was also mentioned in Amiga Future Magazines Amiga Retrospective articles by RT Dickinson. What interestes me is what was RT Dickinsons source for this comment, or just rumors? For if I correctly understood, this podcast mentioned have been done only very recently, while that retrospective article was maybe already 2 years ago or something.

It was also uncovered before that, i don't remeber exactly where anymore but it might have been back at os3.9 betatimes, but then again we've also heard about the warehouses with Amiga's stacked away while claims said there was no more machines, and that one also turned out to be correct.

so i will say, WHAT IF... :)

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See my blog and collection website! . https://www.blog.amigaguru.com

I dont' believe for a second that Microsoft had any interest in Amiga at the time Gatesway was involved.

But I will accept the theory that they heard that QNX/Linux was to be marketed as Amiga desktop and sold with Gatesway pc's. Then it seems likely that they told Gatesway that if they began delivering a non-MS OS, windows price would be much more expensive making Gatesways PC's unattractive for costumers.

I think MS would have reacted like this no matter what OS Gatesway had considered for replacing windows.

BTW. I found the move to QNX to be an exellent choice back then and was rather dissapointed that it never materialised. It was like the Apple move, before apple did it.

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Seriously, I don't understand why you all feel the need for the Amiga to be superior, feared, etc... by anyone after 95-96. When CBM declared bankrupt it was already far far behind anything else. Escom re-released the then 4 years old A1200 to compete with the SNES/PSX/Pentiums (yeah: 14Mhz FPU/MMU less 68020, no hardware scaling/rotation,... VS Pentiums, SNES & PSX)... They also tried to release the very expensive A4000. The OS was also lagging behind Windows & Macs... especially in terms of UI/multimedia. This was the good days of Macromedia-powered CDRoms,.. Then Escom went down as well, so there was nothing for another 3 years or so.

Why do you think anyone would care ? The OS was even more outdated, the hardware was the same as well, the OS was 68k-only so there's no way Gateway could quickly release an OS. What could Microsoft fear (if they even knew it) ? What I think is that BillGates was thinking about launching his own console to compete with Sony/Nintendo, more than what Gateway would do with this outdated hardware/software patents they just bought...

That said, I think I thought it could be possible by then, simply because I was blind. With a different vision it was long lost already by then :) But I'm ok with that, I think that's the difference with today's fans. I still like the Amiga, and do not regret playing with it, and I still do :)

Last edited by Leo on 03-Dec-2011 at 11:23 AM.

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http://www.warpdesign.fr/

@Leo

I agree, by the time Commodore went bankrupt the Amiga was far from being the power house it once was, and I doubt Bill Gates was curled up in the fetal position in a corner because he was afraid of what Amiga might become.

By the time the Amiga 1200 was released I was looking at pentiums systems with CDROM drives and consoles like the 3DO, PSX etc..... The Amiga was looking pretty sad by this time.

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Amiga A1200T - TF1260 - R9200 - Indivision AGA MK3
Amiga A500 - PiStorm EMU68
Pegasos 2 G4 - AmigaOS 4.1 FE / MorphOS 3.16

@Hammer
I understand, Blue Ribbon's was used for something (Win), but in short, Bars Pipers killed.

@Amigadave
A perfect explanation, what I mean, would not be strange that this theory could be true.

Theory: knowledge we have of one thing and that is based on what is assumed or thought, not experience or practice. Darwin developed a theory of human evolution.

Last edited by natamix on 03-Dec-2011 at 12:18 PM.

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He Who Controls the Bootloader

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whoa. forgive me but what is it all about?? petro tyschtschenko or whats his name have himself, with his own bare hands sunk amiga with his unprofessional afterhour amiga technologies and partner company escom even long before any bill gates could notice amiga still exists. i well remember the nineties, the escom stores with these pityful amiga displays and the whole f***ing laghable bussiness they attempted to drag along. and none will convince me it has had any chance to succeed that way. or that petro was the right man for the job anymore than these other losers were.

edit: sad truth, but needs to be told.

Last edited by wawa on 03-Dec-2011 at 03:47 PM.

weird... I have different memories than some others.

Amiga was my main computer until about 1999 and around 1992...1994 I also sold x86 computers and knew exactly what they were capable of.
Amigas were good in HW and SW specs untill around 1995. (not the best in the world)
Even the pathetic A4000D ide outperformed any standard x86 ide etc...
(we got ~1MB per second with 100% CPU load on the fastest x86 while my a4k transferred 2.3MB/sec with smaller CPU usage)

After Win95 the AOS started to fall behind in several ways.
When A4000/040 was released, it performed well against 486. It was faster than 486/50mhz(DX2) in 3D (as Vesa Realsoft Meskanen demonstrated to me).
And it's standard graphics were ok (1440x580HAM8) untill SVGA+1MB became mainstream.
Standard A4000T could play full screen video, unlike standard x86 or Mac, etc...

CBM death slowed down the move to RISC and there was no one to take the leap to 3D games (originally it would only have required FAST ram in a standard in A1200&CD32 and cheaper and more available 50Mhz Amigas, then RTG as standard).

Some people complained Amigas lack of modularity when compared to x86, when it was Amiga that was more flexible (+AOS was like "rubber" when compared to windows & linux & MACOS).


btw. Anyone tried wich one runs Quake2/3 better, ClassicAmiga (with or without PPC) or x86/50DX2.


For the future: I hope we (just) have better management.

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- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
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// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?